Should foreigners get free admission to Chinese museums?

India and Nepal are members of SAARC, the South Asian Association for Regional Cooperation. That's probably what it's about.

Ticketing policies vary the world over. I think most museums in London are free for everyone. And what about those foreigners who live in China and pay Chinese taxes? The mystery goes on. I won't even talk about the soft power that comes from getting outsiders to appreciate your artefacts.

The Kremlin, for example, has a heavily discounted admission price for CIS citizens. But all you have to do is get a friend speaking unaccented Russian to go up and buy the tickets.

Are we really going to check everyone's passport, and tax residence, at the gate? Or are we just going to go back to racial profiling like it used to be with Chinese museums?

Thanks, William. I've added that into the text.

I'm surprised that the author didn't draw a parallel with visa charges, which seem to be done on a parity basis.

One point must be mentioned here: many objects displayed in European museums are looted from China. We go there to try to identify our own goods, why do we have to pay?

Oh, stop whining, Lao Zhang. If you really wanted those artifacts you'd have done a better job of holding onto them in the first place.

Personally, I think the whole idea of charging different admissions on the grounds of who is supposedly paying taxes is rather ridiculous. Afterall, there are many foreigners in China who live, work, and pay taxes there. By the same token, due to the recent abolition of tax for agriculturalists, many Chinese farmers are not required to pay taxes anymore. So if we are going to go by this logic, then the wealthy foreigners in Pudong making 6 digit monthly salaries should get free admission, while the scores of Chinese farmers who pull in less than 1000 RMB a month should be hit with the super expensive tickets. Afterall, they're not paying taxes, are they?

The only fair way to do it is to charge the same price to everybody. One world, one dream, one uniform ticket price.

The money is tiny in comparison to the goodwill. link

"Labour's decision to introduce free admission six years ago has proved to be one of its most popular policies and has seen visitor numbers soar by more than 80 per cent."

I see very many 'probable foreigners' enjoying the free admission to the British Museum, The British Library, The Museum of Natural History, The Victorian and Albert Museum, The Science Museum and many others. I'm proud they are free and open to anyone.

The article is headlined with the word..."foreigners", surely, if we are to follow the rest of your piece, it would be more accurate to state" tourists" in the headline? There are many louwai working here and paying taxes so in effect we are making a contribution. Tourists also spend money in China on travel, food,sightseeing and accommodation so they too are making a contribution. The purpose of museums is to conserve abd to educate. China has a lot of history that should be available to anyone without charge.

I get anxious when there is only one ticket price in China, which seems too high for most locals. Last year I went to a new museum in Chengdu, the Jinsha Museum, and the entrance fee is 80RMB (more than the Forbidden City!). As a result, the place was almost empty.

If the sites are not free for locals, then they need to be reasonably priced to allow locals to visit their own attractions.

I have seen the differential prices in place for monuments in India - 100 times more for non-Indians.
However none of the Indian sites I visited were as expensive for Westerners as one-price MOMA in NYC (or the ROM in Toronto).

I did recently try booking a free ticket at the Capital Museum in Beijing, as instructed at the website. (I could not use the English website, but I made a phone call.) However when I arrived I found I could have just shown up. It had a very lively atmosphere (almost raucous if you were too close to a school group), but local people were enjoying a museum about where they live.

I guess as a fully-employed person, travelling for fun, I am willing to pay to see a site of interest.
I am also likely to buy a postcard or a trinket to help support the museum.
However if it is free for everyone, no problem!

Ticket prices as "negotiation weapon" is a bad idea. In Europe, as far as I know, it would not be allowed to charge different prices depending on the nationality, so there is nothing the Chinese can negotiate for themselves. Treating people differently because of their nationalities can lead to no good.

The best is free museums. London is a great example, and you end up spending more money because you are happy and relaxed and you didn't have to run your way down the aisles to make the most of your tickets.

But I don't see any of this happening in China, where beaches, mountains and even villages (where people are actually living) have an entrance ticket.

And what to say of the absurd "Bund tunnel" in Shanghai, which should be a public service for people to walk across to Liujiazui, and instead it is an expensive dumb neon show. How much business the restaurants on the other side of the bund are losing because of this?

For a socialist country, China should be more social. It pays.

>Afterall, there are many foreigners in China who live, work, and pay taxes there.

There are very little wealthy foreigners in China to begin with and the majority of the tourists aren't foreign nationals working in China.

>The only fair way to do it is to charge the same price to everybody. One world, one dream, one uniform ticket price.

State owned tourist sites would be better off charging no entrance fees and instead price tourist memorabilia, food and drinks on site higher to make up the difference.

Easy solution.

Museums that have high-quality "foreign" language captions throughout (or at the very least a good 10+ page "foreign" guide), and high-quality "foreign" language tape tours like European museums do for Chinese-language guests?

They can charge.

Museums that continue to caption everything only in Chinese, and provide little if anything in the way of guides in "foreign" languages?

They are not allowed to charge.

Let's at least try to compare apples to some other kind of fruit, eh Zhou Wenhan?

When we were in Florence last year, we can't buy discounted tickets which is only available to EU citizen at several museums, as we didn't have our passport with us. Even though we show our driver's licenses (with photo & address) and our medical cards, but we were told this only tell that we live in UK. We have to show that we are British citizen (we are) to get the discount because the museum has received EU funding.

This is like holding Mexicans who has not been in Mexico for years, for the flu that is happening in Mexico, while letting Chinese coming back from Mexico to run free in China. This is the Chinese characteristics.

Don't even try to guess at the rationale, because there isn't any.

"in Rome, I visited twenty museums whose ticket prices totaled more than 200 euros. I joked to a friend that when I was mugged at knife-point in Spain, it had been open theft, so compared to that, here in Italy I'd been subject to civilized theft by Romans wielding cultural artifacts"

Which is like 10 Euros per museum, which is cheaper than most of the Chinese museums I have visited. But the author says state funded museums in China are now mostly free. Really? Roughly what percentage of museums are state-funded? Is there anywhere to go for information on this? Are places like the Forbidden City included in this?

The art gallery in my hometown in New Zealand used to be (maybe still is) free for residents of that city, while tourists, either from elsewhere in NZ or the world had to pay. But there were no checks of visitors' addresses, so if you wanted to pretend to be a local you could.

I think the free bit is about museums being free for eldsters and students. And many museums have free entry one day a week, usually a Tuesday or Thursday. If this free for foreigners policy was implemented, how long before we were regaled by pictures of some foreign chavs riding a revolutionary cannon or posing inappropriately in from of a bust of Chairman Mao? The whole idea is bound to fail.

Let's first give heavy discounts for the Chinese students & teachers. It is ridiculous, that kids have to pay the same price as adults. How they can learn? Second, as @koos said before me, similar idea as in the rest of the world: one weekday is free.

Additionally, when the visa rules are strict, even free museums won't attract the foreigners.

The whole idea of ticketing needs to be more regulated. Why the tickets to Forbidden City and even Terracotta Warriors are cheaper than to visit some other "scenic villages" in the countryside???

With all the comments about scenic villages prices vs. museum prices. You guys have to keeping in mind the difference between public museum and a private museum/theme park. For example Elizabeth Gardner Museum in Boston cost nearly the same as the Museum of Fine Arts, Boston, even though MFA has a far bigger collection. (And as far as theme parks go, none of the museums cost the same as Disneyland) As long as they can make a profit, they can charge as much as they want, as far as privately run museums and scenic parks go.

As far as the one free day, a week at some museums. At least in the US, these events are sponsored by private companies. For example MFA is free on Thursdays, but it just means Citizens Bank (RBS's US branch) pays for the tickets in exchange for having the RBS logo on the ticket.

Also 10 Euro is about 100 RMB and 150 RMB if taken at exchange rate last year when he traveled, and you have look long and hard to find museum at this price tag.

In my humble opinion, ticket pricing policies are indeed a problematic issue.

In South East Asia, namely Thailand and Vietnam there exists a two tier pricing structure, one for locals, one for foreigners. While I understand the rationale for a local economy price for locals, the impact of such a pricing policy institutionally reinforces a belief of economic inferiority. We are poor; you are rich. This effectively becomes an entrenched mindset, and does little to empower the people of such a nation. Imagine if in the UK we allowed nationals of less economically developed or successful nations to pay less for their admissions tickets. This would be seen as patronising, insulting and racist.

In essence, this is inverse neo-colonialism, where the nation concerned inadvertently deepens its sense of inferior relationship even though it may think its profiting from extracting top dollar from its foreign visitors.

Finally, on a personal level I found it endlessly annoying to be subjected to such a regime at every turn, and found myself rapidly losing respect for the culture that enforced these policies.

So one price, regardless of citizenship or nationality - that's a mature, respectful and easily workable policy.

How about museums in China develop some merchandise that visitors can buy. What's on offer now is the cheapest of cheap crap, or brochures designed in the 80th that never got changed.

A Starbucks quality coffee is nice and I am willing to pay for it. But what's on offer is usually instant noodles, again, the cheapest they could find.

Foreigners don't pay taxes? I'm under the impression that hotels in China do charge foreign guests taxes. And what about the fuel surcharge foreign vistors paid to Chinese airlines flying in and all the shopping they've done? Weren't those money foreigners injected into the local economy?

Anyway, China brags about its glorious 5,000 years of civilization all the time so it should ne enlightened enough to share that with the rest of the world - free of charge.

"Foreigners don't pay taxes? I'm under the impression that hotels in China do charge foreign guests taxes."

Hotels pay business taxes to the government, citizens foot the museum bills through income taxes, foreign tourists don't pay income tax. You should really understand what you're saying first.

"Anyway, China brags about its glorious 5,000 years of civilization all the time so it should ne enlightened enough to share that with the rest of the world - free of charge."

Naaaaah. Why would museums that receive tons of foreign visitors not what to make a buck? That would truly not be enlightened.

"...which may seem a little retaliatory"

That's because - in the great Chinese tradition - it is.

China would do better to set an example for the rest of the world instead of continuously seeking to justify unfair practices on the grounds that "well, look what they did".

"Hotels pay business taxes to the government, citizens foot the museum bills through income taxes, foreign tourists don't pay income tax. You should really understand what you're saying first."

However Chinese hotels deal with their tax issues with the government is not my concern and the point of this discussion. The writer of the article says foreigner don't pay tax as the basis of his other assertions and that is not valid as visitors do get charged a 10% hotel tax. That's what my point was.

"Naaaaah. Why would museums that receive tons of foreign visitors not what to make a buck? That would truly not be enlightened."

If the whole point about preserving national heritage is making a quick buck then why not charge tax-paying Chinese citizens entry as well? Why was it even relevant that "foreigners don't pay taxes"?

"The writer of the article says foreigner don't pay tax as the basis of his other assertions and that is not valid as visitors do get charged a 10% hotel tax."

Are you saying that the 10% hotel tax goes to finance the public museums? If they do, then the author's point of charging tourists because they don't pay taxes to support the public museums would seem moot.

"If the whole point about preserving national heritage is making a quick buck"

I don't recall anyone saying the whole point was to make a buck.

"Are you saying that the 10% hotel tax goes to finance the public museums? If they do, then the author's point of charging tourists because they don't pay taxes to support the public museums would seem moot."

Maybe the 10% hotel tax makes a difference or maybe not. In any case I don't see any stats that show how much of the museums' income come from tourists tickets and how much from local taxes, do you?

"I don't recall anyone saying the whole point was to make a buck."

hmmm...right.

"Maybe the 10% hotel tax makes a difference or maybe not. In any case I don't see any stats that show how much of the museums' income come from tourists tickets and how much from local taxes, do you?"

Interesting, so you don't actually know if the 10% tax goes to fund museums yet you assert the hotel tax validates foreign tourists paying taxes for public museums...

I don't know if the 10% hotel tax would go to the museums more than you know what percentage of other forms of taxes in China have actually gone to the museums. So I guess we're both talking our of our asses.

1 I agree with some of the comments : if the reason to charge more foreigners is because they don't pay taxes in China, so it's not a Chinese-Foreigner problem. It is a tax payer- non tax payer problem.
2. The autor of the article had a long journey in Europe. Nice for him. Before writing his article he could also to Chinese Museums and understand their pricing policy. The Local-Foreigner pricing difference still exists in some museums in China. For example at the Palace Museum, foreigner above 60 years old have no discount, Chinese elderly have. But, weel, is that the real point of this article ? Or simply another piece of xenophobic piece of article?

>So I guess we're both talking our of our asses.

sure sure, but you sure don't pay those income tax that foots the bill for state museums

Stuart:

"That's because - in the great Chinese tradition - it is [retaliatory].

China would do better to set an example for the rest of the world instead of continuously seeking to justify unfair practices on the grounds that "well, look what they did"."

Thank you, thank you Stuart, for making this important point. I'm a foreigner who pays income taxes in China and pays foreigner prices at some attractions (illegal for approximately the last 15 years I'm told, but nice try, Zhou), but still of prime importance to me this this point: China has the power and wherewithal to set an admirable example. Instead of proving to the rest of the world that they suffer from a debilitating persecution complex, they should take the opportunity to show the rest of the world how it's done. Equal ticket prices are a gesture of goodwill and a way to show China can place itself above the fray.

This idea is purely racist and most things have been said about this already, so i dont need to repeat them.

However, if u want to use the ticket price as a weapon and a way to revenche this comes no good. If Chinese museums let foreigners pay entrance tickets then why should not the italian museums charge in return chinese nationals more? Lets say 200 Euro for one entry. In this logic of punishment and counter-punishment, this would simply be fair.

Another point is that the museums are free not without a reason. Many of those museums are actually just some kind of propaganda institutions to show off how great china is and some places were always a part of china and such things. Why should they charge for such a thing?

And finally: Ticket prices in China are much higher than in Europe. Not only in relation to the income but also in total. National parks in Europe are usually for free, in China you easily pay 200 RMB. Should Europe now also start to charge only Chinese?

The author is petty and insecure, and his considerations smack of Chinese self-importance, which has taken a turn for the worse since the world financial crisis and the illusion that China has now become the world's savior.
Thing like a great power. Small tokens of generosity like not spliting pennies with guests can be a good start.

I often say that China will remain a "massive power" but not a great one, until a higher portion of the Chinese population behave with the kind of confidence and grace that behooves a great nation.

Some of its citizens already got there. We were in Qingdao a while ago, and I found people there are a lot more, well, respectable, than folks in Shanghai or Beijing. We were on this pier when an idea of a picture of the two of us struck our fancy. I was just turning my head to look for some help when a passerby stopped and flashed us with a relaxed smile and asked if he could lend a hand. He took a picture, asked us to check if we're happy with it, nodded, and left with a wave of hand. Nothing extraordinary, but the whole act was done with a natural ease, with no eagerness nor complacency.
If we see more of that, we may warm to the prospect of China as a super power and "leader of the world".

Orpheus - "The author is petty and insecure, and his considerations smack of Chinese self-importance ... and the illusion that China has now become the world's savior."

Ironic that you think the official line perpetuated in the western media somehow speaks for "China".

Believe it or not, using my US military retired ID card, I manage to get the reduced entrance fee most places, and where the fee is waived for soldiers, I can usually get in free.

I first tried this at the China Aviation Museum, and was waved right in.

"Oh, stop whining, Lao Zhang. If you really wanted those artifacts you'd have done a better job of holding onto them in the first place"

Posted by: Maj. Denis Bloodnok | May 19, 2009 9:16 PM

So if your wife gets raped, she should have defended herself better, right?

the logic on here is an instant /facepalm

Xuan Wang, I don't think you get the reference. Major Bloodnok is a character from the "Goon Show". The post isn't meant to be taken seriously.

Nonsense, Xuan Wang: we British don't concern ourselves with base things like sex and rape. That's why there aren't 1.4 billion of us.

Many Museums in China do not give students a discount and that seems wrong.

Free museums are not a good idea because they can become crowded by people who are not interested in the Museum but want somewhere to hang out all day (including vagrants and drug dealers in London). So Museums should charge a little (example 40 RMB, 20 for students and elderly). No need to worry about crowds of foreign tourists hanging about all day (because 40 RMB might be cheap to them) because there are relatively few foreign tourists in China (per city).

On the tax issue: foreigners working in China get issued a fancy foreign expert certificate. This was supposed to get them local prices in hotels and museums, but it is not used now (although they still issue them). So, for local prices one could show the FEC or equivalent to show you get paid Chinese salary and pay tax to China.

As mentioned above, I have seen many museums here where all signs labels and guides were in Chinese. So many foreign tourists get less value from Chinese museums than Chinese readers do. So on balance, maybe charge same or similar.

Finally, can´t use ticket prices to negotiate because I don´t think any European government cares how much their nationals pay for tickets on holiday. The Chinese government might care how much its people pay overseas, but in Europe the governments don´t care.